Ba=Al worth it?

[amp5]

I've seen different references to this card around the forum. My impression upon first getting and testing this card was that it isn't worth using it. Now, months later, after looking at this card every time I edit fire creatures and reading the various posts, I decided to try him out again.

Now that I have a much more powerful deck, I am firmly convinced that the random destruction of a (likely very useful) card from my hand is not worth the power Ba=Al brings to the match.

Just a thought for anyone thinking about using this card, or anyone who currently does and finds it useful.

[WhoseYerLilith]

I'm in total disagreement.

We're talking about a 50 50 first strike red creature thats of medium difficulty to summon. (And cake to summon if you utilize a Conjurer). The Basalt Idol can cancel out his card destructive tendencies, but even beyond that he can use items with abandon, making him a strong attacker and a defender. His HP is too high to blast and most AI Cepters can't come up with enough to even think about taking him out. True, his card destructo ability definitely sucks, but thats only if he's called to battle, which most enemy cepters will avoid if they don't want to lose their creature, so you just have to make him worth your while (I.E- LEVELLED UP). I'd gladly lose a card from my hand to collect a 590 toll. I use a lot of Telegnosis and Silver Plows, so my Ba'Als become levelled up ASAP.

I'm not gonna front here, we all know we're all entitled to our opinions, but since your thought was thrown out to people who are thinking about using this card or to people who do use it who find it useful (including yours truly) I wanted to respond with my personal protest.

My Ba'Al deck (4 Conjurers, 4 Ba'Als- whoopass!) is now 79 and 1, and to this match I've only seen 2 Ba'Al's die.
One was the victim of a Sonic Wave and Evil Blast, the other to a Decoy with a Dynamite. But still, changing someone's mind is near impossible.

[amp5]

You make a convincing argument. I recognize Ba=Al's power, and the usefullness of using a conjurer.

I suppose my aversion to this card is a matter of principle, similar to the feeling one has when haunt is cast on the user's character. Every one of the cards in my hand is picked with care, and I dislike the idea that my carefully laid plans will be either: a) misplayed by the computer during haunt or b) undone by Ba=Al's card sacrifice.

I'll check out your Basalt Idol suggestion, as the card destruction is the only thing preventing Ba=Al from becoming a creature I use. Too bad you can't pick the card destroyed, then it would be a no brainer.

Thanks for your feedback.

On a different note, does anyone know about a
Culdcept 2 maybe?

I'm not far from 50 medals and will be bummed when there are no more Culdcept goals

[TheSynapZe]

No matter what our opinions are, the makers of this game just loved Ba'al. You have the Ba'al card, the Conjurer which can summon Ba'al, and the Trapezon which turns you into Ba'al. They must be totally Ba'al-crazy!

I guess the intimidation factor of Ba'al is helpful, but I'd want to use a creature like that aggressively. The card destruction side effect makes it more difficult to choose to invade for you.

Also, I kind of wish that the Conjurer summoned a random demonic creature (Imps, Succubi, Mephistopheles) instead of just Ba'al. That would have made him more interesting.

[Kuroi Kenshi]

I'm at work, and my memory is a bit rusty with Culdcept stats/costs, so work with me here. If you're on a smaller board, wouldn't a Manticore be in a league of it's own compared to Ba=Al? In my mind there's no sacrifice needed and he is a 30/50 and has First Strike as well (I could be wrong about 30/50) and +10 ST to a max of 80 per board lap.

I do however like a Conjurer. Again, I can't remember exactly, but I use to use a Sorcerer for fun and when I received a Conjurer I thought "Wait, this guy is the same, but after I kill something from an attack, I can sacrifice him to drop a Ba=Al somewhere else? Sweet!" Just my 2 g ;D

[AceLeader]

You're thinking about Chimera, not Masticore, the 30/50 FS dude. And I agree, I prefer Chimera. I've easily had an 80/50 FS guarding my spaces. Ba-Al costs a card to play AND one at the end of combat. That being said, on the Offense, Ba-Al is much better. Chimera is a strictly defensive creature, in my mind. so Ba-Al is more of a do-it-all guy, he attacks, defends, is a nice early-game creature(although his G cost is a little high). Also, I want to point out that Gold Idol helps Ba-Al a lot, because I hate having to sacrifice a card to play other cards. If you can't utelize all your cards in your deck, then you need to revamp the deck, not throw away cards metagame for no reason.

Conjurer, I think everyone agrees, is awesome. Placing a *Good* creature on any space in the area is awesome. Right next to your opponent's biggest space so you get +10 ST, or finishing off the 5-chain you need, or taking over a vacant high-level land.

[Kuroi Kenshi]

Oh yeah, Chimera - duh! Thanks. I don't know why I even thought Manticore. Maybe because they're both red. -_- Just revisiting all that you posted: I agree with you AceLeader on the fact that having to throw away a card is horrid. But you can't always match it up to the fact that someone needs to refine there deck. Sometimes a card might be less useful in a situation that Ba=Al can, perhaps, get you out. Either way, if someone used 4 I would highly recommend Gold Idols as well! They make lots of cards worth having that someone would not have considered previously. The only problem is keeping them alive if you base a portion of your deck around them and the double edge sword effect.

[cerealkiller251]

I think it is worth it. I almost always use Brass Idol and/or Find card, so if I lose a valuable card, it isnt that long until the deck is reshuffled anyway.

[quikdraw77]

When it comes to Ba=Al....its depends on the type of deck your workin with.....He works Great with a "mono-red" deck, because if he takes down a card, he wont really hinder your all-fire strategy. However, if your an extreme spell-caster, or have a multi-colored deck (like me), then its best to have him sit, as he can destroy certain spells & monsters at the absolute WORST time.....

Even worse to have him defend a moderately leveled land....with land hungry cepters such as Leo, Zenith, and Zagol afoot, invasion will happen often, and with each invasion he survives, another card will bite the dust. This might not seem so bad on him, as he can reap you an incredible amount of G, but it will hurt his fellow high-land-defending creatures, as some of them might not have no other means of defense other than a Gaseous Form or Petrify Stone. If the cards are in your hand, and he destroys them...he can make the REST OF YOUR LANDS vulnerable for takeover if you let him --------> not good.

In my opinion..Ba=Al best usage is for a quick takeover of a slightly leveled land, which is what his 50hp/50st & 1st attack are good for.....but if you dont mind your deck getting ripped, then be my guest!

[someguy]

Yeah, I think quickdraw77 has it. Generally, BA=AL just seems to cost way too much G and trouble and cards for what he is. If he was some kind of unkillable monster with ST or HP closer to 80, or if his casting cost were lower, then maybe.

You really get the sense that some Culdcept cards were modeled after Magic cards. This would be Omiya Soft's attempt to re-create the Juzam Djinn, for those that play, but I don't think they pulled it off.

[gamefiend]

the only time I ever use Ba=al is with conjurer --conjurer is strong because he is cheap to place and early game he is essentially a half-cost upheaval -- pay 80, upgrade to a strong creature *and* build up your fire chain!

Ba=al is typically too expensive, especially compared to valkyria, who is ridiculously strong for her cost. Support + first attack + pump is just too good.

[quikdraw77]

Gamefiend, i definitely agree with you there, on the Ba=al/Valkyria comparison. Ba=al is definitely a force not to be taken lighty, but its his nasty nature of punishing his owner as well as his enemy, that makes him a tough fit to a deck that has cards that "pair together".

Valkyria......er...yeah....she damages.....A LOT. Coming onto the battlefield with 1st strike (a blessing for an invader), No Limitations, AND the support ability, she has the ability to deal illegal amounts of HP damage almost every fight. After a few defensive victories, even an empty-handed Valkyria will become quite a nusiance, thanks to her "Every-enemy-i-kill-makes-me-stronger" attitude. This means ST+10 after every win on the defense, up to a maximum of 80ST. Combine a fully-charged Valkyria with an Executor(and an ally beside her) and you'll deal 160 damage - an incredibly painful blow - and it means death to any creature not protected by means of Neutralization, The Grail, or Simulacrum.